Ep89: Dzogchen, Hypnosis, & Psychopaths - Dr Ian Wickramasekera & Petra Tauchner

Dialogues
Written By Guru Viking

In this episode I host a dialogue between Dr Ian Wickramasekera and Petra Tauchner on Dr Ian’s ‘Empathic Involvement Theory’ of hypnosis.

Dr Ian Wickramasekera is a Bön Buddhist practitioner and associate professor of Mindfulness Based Transpersonal Counselling at Naropa University, and Petra Tauchner is a student at the University of Vienna with a degree in microbiology and genetics, whose current batchelor’s thesis in psychology is based on Dr Ian’s ‘Empathic Involvement Theory’ of hypnosis.

In the first part of this interview, Dr Ian gives an overview of the history of the mysteries and theories of hypnosis, lays out his own journey to formulating EIT, and discusses its implications for therapy and enlightenment.

Then, Dr Ian and Petra dialogue about how to increase one’s own hypnotisability, why empathy does not guarantee pro-social outcomes, and the very particular empathy skills of psychopaths – including a case review of Dr Ian’s own psychopathic client. 

Dr Ian also recounts his own experiences practicing Dzogchen, meeting spiritual gurus, and taking ayahuasca, while Petra reveals her own passion for first hand research, including a life-changing 21 day water fast undertaken to reset her dopamine system.  


Also available on Youtube, iTunes, & Spotify – search ‘Guru Viking Podcast’.

Topics Include:

0:00 – Intro 
01:12 – What is EIT?
04:43 – How Ian began to suspect a connection between empathy and hypnotisability 
08:12 – A summary of the main theories of hypnosis
13:23 – Trance states in client centred therapy 
19:19 – Empathy-induced hypnosis and correlations with absorption 
29:26- Studying transference and the Self 
34:40 – Reconciling the two main theories of hypnosis
42:50 – ‘Real’ experience and the default mode network 
48:10 – Clinical application of hypnosis for chronic pain 
1:08:48 – EIT Summary 
01:11:55 – Petra’s research interests and first set of questions 
1:12:31 – Does Scacchia and De Pescalis (2020) challenge EIT?
1:16:32 – 4 different kinds of empathy
1:26:51 – Do psychopaths have empathy?
1:27:42 -Dr Ian’s first client was a psychopath 
1:30:55 – Empathy is not compassion
1:34:22 – The case of the Hillside Strangler 
1:42:10 – Rethinking empathy measurement techniques
1:44:26 – How to increase your hypnotisability 
1:52:26 – Gurus & ayahuasca 
1:55:26 – Measuring enlightenment 
2:04:53 – Practicing Dzogchen 
2:14:14 – Petra’s 21 day water fast 
1:16:35 – Ian’s take on detox, Tummo diets, and the ayahuasca dieta
2:22:12 – Why did Petra undertake a 21 day water fast?
02:24:14 – The importance of first hand research 
02:29:43 – Ian encourages Petra’s research 
02:31:00 – Petra’s reflections 

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